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Thread: Child Zombies

  1. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shineblossom View Post
    Child or not, same ♥♥♥♥. Point being that it is more immersive. And adds new type of zombie that will be different while staying in terms of "reality". Also, what do you think were the most feared thing from Silent Hill by most people? Yep, those damned childern.
    We only have about a dozen different zombie models in the game. The explanation for the immersion knights among us is that the world was obviously populated by clones before.

  2. #17
    Ranger NukemDed's Avatar
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    qualify your position please.
    i have children and do not want to have children zombies in the game.
    if you have children and still are enamoured with the concept of eviscerating child like entities then i pity your children and i hope the authorities are monitoring this sort of discussion.
    also qualify your response with your real age.
    i am 48 and have 4 sons 20 to 13 yo

  3. #18
    Colony Founder AtomicUs5000's Avatar
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    When the ♥♥♥♥ hits the fan, I’m making note of who to take with me in the apoc. There’s no room for calling zombies people or children where we’re going.
    Last edited by Crater Creator; 06-17-2019 at 09:33 AM. Reason: language filter

  4. #19
    Ranger NukemDed's Avatar
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    age please
    got kids?
    Last edited by Crater Creator; 06-17-2019 at 09:29 AM. Reason: name calling

  5. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shineblossom View Post
    Supporting the "horror" tag with more things than garage doors being 3 blocks wide and drawbridge 4 blocks wide, as Roland said

    I do completely understand why TFP do not want to include this kind of.. content.. in the game. It is their game, and their choice. But you should not be demonitizing people who like more immersion and / or heavier swing into horror gendre.
    The game is also popular with many who don't like horror movies because it doesn't contain so much horror. I don't like horror movies myself but have no problems with the game. If you drift more into the horror genre then you would scare these players away.

    The game is not a pure horror game but contains horror elements but also survival elements, tower defense elements and sandbox elements. If you put more emphasis on one area then the other areas will suffer.

  6. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by NukemDed View Post
    qualify your position please.
    i have children and do not want to have children zombies in the game.
    if you have children and still are enamoured with the concept of eviscerating child like entities then i pity your children and i hope the authorities are monitoring this sort of discussion.
    also qualify your response with your real age.
    i am 48 and have 4 sons 20 to 13 yo
    As some are trying to point out, that logic isn't being applied consistently. "If you work with guys in business suits and are still enamored with the concept of eviscerating zombies in business suits, then I pity your coworkers and I hope the authorities are monitoring this sort of discussion." Would that be fair?

  7. #22
    Colony Founder AtomicUs5000's Avatar
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    I own a dog and would never harm a dog... or any animal in fact. In a survival situation, I would kill a deer, some boar, a bear, a wolf. If my dog became a zombie dog, I would kill her. You hear that authorities?

  8. #23
    Tracker Shineblossom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RipClaw View Post
    We only have about a dozen different zombie models in the game. The explanation for the immersion knights among us is that the world was obviously populated by clones before.
    There are 391,000 species of plants in the game, 8.7 million species of animals, about 10 000 species of mushrooms. Do we need them all? No. They are not all needed for immersion. Though fishes would be nice.

    Can we have them all? Also no. Why? Many reasons. Let's start with the fact that it would take loads of work. And neither of us have HDD, let alone SSD big enough to fit all the data on our computers.

    Childern? Yes, it is morally wrong. Yes, TFP have very, VERY good reason NOT TO add them. But is the fact that they are missing breaking immersion? Kinda. Yes, we do not have baby animals. But we have schools, kindegardens, playgrounds, school buses.

    Can we walk around this? Yes. If we ever get NPC villages ala Minecraft, there might be childern. Explanation? People under certain age are immune to the virus. Easy as that.

    Quote Originally Posted by NukemDed View Post
    qualify your position please.
    i have children and do not want to have children zombies in the game.
    if you have children and still are enamoured with the concept of eviscerating child like entities then i pity your children and i hope the authorities are monitoring this sort of discussion.
    also qualify your response with your real age.
    i am 48 and have 4 sons 20 to 13 yo
    I do not want to be mean, but i think you are a bit hypersensitive. Also, refer to my answer just before your quote, i think that will clear things up. At least in my perspective. Some people would not be satisfied with living childern and literally want zombie ones. Can't blame them. Horror gendre is horror gendre. Some people do not even like it, yet still want it, just to be more scared / disgusted by zombies. You can call it masochism.

    Also, to qualify my response with my real age - 23. I do not have childern. I do have little sister. And no, i do not associaty my little sister with every child monster from every game, movie or book i know. I can draw a line between real life and fantasy. Or do you think that people playing Payday are all murderers and thieves?

    Quote Originally Posted by RipClaw View Post
    The game is also popular with many who don't like horror movies because it doesn't contain so much horror. I don't like horror movies myself but have no problems with the game. If you drift more into the horror genre then you would scare these players away.

    The game is not a pure horror game but contains horror elements but also survival elements, tower defense elements and sandbox elements. If you put more emphasis on one area then the other areas will suffer.
    I do not think that adding two more skins into game would kill "survival elements" , "tower defense" or "sandbox". More like opposite. If your morality would stop you from shooting, you would die.

  9. #24
    Ranger NukemDed's Avatar
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    robots or aliens or orcs or an invading force all in enemy uniform is easy to rationise as only a game for any age i suppose.
    start visualising the enemy like the girl next door requires at least some maturity AND intellect to not fug with your perspective. to see calls of give me children to massacre gives me the creeps.

  10. #25
    Ranger NukemDed's Avatar
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    i am largely impressed with this discussion as it is staying quite civil :-)
    anyone who wears a tie needs a zombie avatar so i can smash their brains out.
    damn - went off the rails sorry

    any sensitivity has been cauterised. i am rather nuggety by most peer reviews.

    remember its just a game. but if someone wants some icky stuff to get their jollies then maybe its a cry for help.

  11. #26
    Community Moderator Crater Creator's Avatar
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    And so we see how quickly this topic tends to become as heated as politics or religion would be, if we allowed those subjects. I'm moving it to Pimp Dreams before the Dev Diary catches on fire.

  12. #27
    Ranger NukemDed's Avatar
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    lol!

  13. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shineblossom View Post
    I do not think that adding two more skins into game would kill "survival elements" , "tower defense" or "sandbox". More like opposite. If your morality would stop you from shooting, you would die.
    I wouldn't play the game at all anymore and accordingly I couldn't die.
    And even if I would still play the game, I would just start my editor and write a modlet to remove these kids zombies from the game. Problem solved.

  14. #29
    Tracker Shineblossom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RipClaw View Post
    I wouldn't play the game at all anymore and accordingly I couldn't die.
    And even if I would still play the game, I would just start my editor and write a modlet to remove these kids zombies from the game. Problem solved.
    Of course, that is your right. Some people would welcome it, some would not. In the part you answered to, i wasn't talking about morality, people opinions or anything like that.
    I was simply reacting to your argument about adding such a feature would be killing other elements of the game

  15. #30
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    Now with that out of the way... NukemDed, Are you familiar with The Walking Dead game?

    In the third episode, spoiler alert, a ten year old boy named Duck is succumbing to the zombie infection. The player is given the choice to shoot him themselves, let his father do it, or do nothing and let him turn. The game aggregates statistics on these major plot points, so we know what players decided to do.


    Let's use this example to tackle some preconceptions.

    • A game where you kill children would require a highly restrictive AO (adults only) rating.
      The ESRB gave The Walking Dead a mature rating, the same as 7DtD. In fact the ESRB makes no distinction between child and adult characters in its content descriptors.

    • Okay, but even with a mature rating, a game where you kill children couldn't be very popular or sell very well.
      The Walking Dead wasn't some fringe game on the margins of the game industry. It was a success by all accounts: a critically acclaimed game of the year, that sold millions of copies and catapulted a company and a whole genre back into the spotlight.

    • Okay, but even if it's possible, only a tiny minority of 'bad' people would actively choose to kill a child in a game.
      According to the game's wiki (which can be verified in the game itself), 79% of players shot Duck and 21% didn't. The people that chose to kill a child formed the strong majority. And implying that this large group of people needs help, or deserves added scrutiny in real life is both unfair and insulting.

    • Okay, but describing what's depicted as 'killing a child' must be a distortion.
      Duck wasn't some monstrous abstraction that only technically had some child-like features. He was presented as a living human child that looked and acted like a living human child. The game uses a non-photorealistic rendering style (like Borderlands) that could be called 'cartoony', but the characters have lifelike anatomy, proportions, voices, etc. and the game shows visceral, gory detail.

    • Okay, but context is important. The Walking Dead is a different kind of game, that takes the time to develop the characters and steer the player in specific, scripted situations.
      On this point, I agree. In TWD, shooting Duck was a weighty decision - something to agonize over and discuss at length. 7DtD is not a story-driven game, and child zombies would in practice be a different-looking kind of zombie you have to dispatch like any other. So it would be appropriate to save the child zombie idea for a different game where it could be more compelling, serve more of a narrative purpose, where a more controlled environment would allow it to do more creepy horror things, etc.

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