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Thread: No Tier 6 Crafting

  1. #181
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    why not have something to look forward too when u see thatntier 6 looted? cmon guys, dont be so spoiled.

  2. #182
    Super Moderator Roland's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zagan View Post
    So if that's the case then why even have crafting in the game? Since it's just more "fun" to find what you need in loot, as you say then who needs crafting right? Oh wait, the game says it's a "Survival CRAFTING" game. Well gee, I guess they almost understand that some people like to craft things. But they just don't want us to be able to craft anything good now. Well I think that totally sucks. I say why not just give mats instead of finished items in the loot. That way you have to do both crafting and fighting.

    IDK, that might be too complex for players who can't handle the crafting part. That's OK, I'll just make mods that fix it so you can craft tier 6 stuff. Because really this game pretty much sucks without mods anyways. They ruin wild with the nerf bat with every update. By the time they get done we'll all be running around naked with only a bone knife and a single bandage.

    (Yeah it can't be a Bone Shiv anymore because that might offend convicts I guess, pffft)
    Over the last 18 alphas there have been releases where we couldn't even craft weapons at all. There have been other releases where we assembled weapons from parts but the parts couldn't be crafted. There have been other releases where we could craft guns by using molds to make the parts. Currently we can craft guns out of basic materials and one component that must be looted.

    Through all of these changes over the past 6 years the game was still a crafting game. It still is a crafting game. They will be continuing to balance and tweak things to make sure crafting is relevant and works well with looting.

    The sky has not fallen.

  3. #183
    Colony Founder AtomicUs5000's Avatar
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    I think the best way would be if both sides of the coin got some love.
    Some of the best items you can only loot... AND some of the best items you can only craft.

  4. #184
    Leader Laz Man's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sythalin View Post
    Moreso by the fact that they actually can, they just have to press U.

    But I hear you, the more they make the game have longevity and top tier worth, the more people are crying. I don't understand it either.
    It's called change. When some folks get use to one thing and have a hard time adapting once it changes. The reality is some will adapt and continue while others will struggle through the process and may just give up and move on.

  5. #185
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    Quote Originally Posted by AtomicUs5000 View Post
    I think the best way would be if both sides of the coin got some love.
    Some of the best items you can only loot... AND some of the best items you can only craft.
    I feel TFPs are doing just this. They are still testing things out trying to find the right balance between looting and crafting. I don't get any feeling that the state it is in now is final from what I've read.

  6. #186
    Leader Laz Man's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AtomicUs5000 View Post
    I think the best way would be if both sides of the coin got some love.
    Some of the best items you can only loot... AND some of the best items you can only craft.
    Yeah, some legendary crafts would be nice, the mats should just need to be challenging and or take a while to get...

  7. #187
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    i hate this change. Its such a luck based game now. Congrats on taking away an achievment for the player and replacing it with lottery. Not fun.

    I got a lot of tier 6 stuff yeah. Triples, Doubles some things even 4 times. But a single pick-, fireaxe or shovel? A pistol? A Junk turret? A stunbaton? Not on day 65. You build up your character in a certain way and then you have to rely on rng. meh.

  8. #188
    Super Moderator Roland's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pApA^LeGBa View Post
    i hate this change. Its such a luck based game now. Congrats on taking away an achievment for the player and replacing it with lottery. Not fun.

    I got a lot of tier 6 stuff yeah. Triples, Doubles some things even 4 times. But a single pick-, fireaxe or shovel? A pistol? A Junk turret? A stunbaton? Not on day 65. You build up your character in a certain way and then you have to rely on rng. meh.
    Wrong.

    Tier 5 is plenty powerful to rely upon and you can craft it. There is nothing critical or necessary about Tier 6 for gameplay. It's nice to have and those few items you find that are Tier 6 are hopefully fantastic. But you can win the game and overcome anything for survival and even thriving by using Tier 5 equipment and it is entirely in your hands to craft those. The ONLY problem I see in what you described is the fact that you are getting lots of tier 6 stuff. It should be maybe a half dozen at most in a 100 day playthrough.

  9. #189
    Leader Laz Man's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pApA^LeGBa View Post
    i hate this change. Its such a luck based game now. Congrats on taking away an achievment for the player and replacing it with lottery. Not fun.

    I got a lot of tier 6 stuff yeah. Triples, Doubles some things even 4 times. But a single pick-, fireaxe or shovel? A pistol? A Junk turret? A stunbaton? Not on day 65. You build up your character in a certain way and then you have to rely on rng. meh.
    I sorta like how you cant get things right away, it makes you make different choices which leads to each playthrough being different. In my current game (Day 50) I have 7 junk turrets but no m60. I'm currently specced for INT to take advantage of all the turrets and having a blast with my horde base.

    Hopefully I get an M60 in my next playthrough so I can try a different strategy/build.
    Last edited by Laz Man; 12-07-2019 at 01:09 AM.

  10. #190
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    Quote Originally Posted by Laz Man View Post
    I sorta like how you cant get things right away
    I'm confused. What does crafting stuff have anything to do with getting them right away. You can't craft tier 5 gear until you get 10 points into a stat and then raise the stat to 5. So at a minimum someone needs 21 skill points to get a particular skill to cap so they can craft 5's. That doesn't give them the resources or the materials (i.e. weapon/tool/armor parts) that they then still need to farm up, which are also random. I also like how your final comment makes the point about loot being completely luck based even further. To make an M60 you need to find a book on top of all the previous things I listed (assuming it ranks along with automatic weapon skill under fort). In essence, your response might have well have been, 'I like turtles!' because it doesn't actually address anything you quoted at all. So cool, you like an aspect of the game that would barely change if people could craft tier 6 at 5 in the relevant skill. Cool, I guess?

  11. #191
    Leader Laz Man's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Niil945 View Post
    I'm confused. What does crafting stuff have anything to do with getting them right away. You can't craft tier 5 gear until you get 10 points into a stat and then raise the stat to 5. So at a minimum someone needs 21 skill points to get a particular skill to cap so they can craft 5's. That doesn't give them the resources or the materials (i.e. weapon/tool/armor parts) that they then still need to farm up, which are also random. I also like how your final comment makes the point about loot being completely luck based even further. To make an M60 you need to find a book on top of all the previous things I listed (assuming it ranks along with automatic weapon skill under fort). In essence, your response might have well have been, 'I like turtles!' because it doesn't actually address anything you quoted at all. So cool, you like an aspect of the game that would barely change if people could craft tier 6 at 5 in the relevant skill. Cool, I guess?
    I was referring to his comment about not having certain items. Reading comprehension for the win. 😂

    I like turtles!!!! 😎👍
    Last edited by Laz Man; 12-07-2019 at 01:45 AM.

  12. #192
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    Quote Originally Posted by Laz Man View Post
    I was referring to his comment about not having certain items. Reading comprehension for the win. ��

    I like turtles!!!! ����
    You quoted his entire post and then expect someone to infer you're referencing single very specific comment outside the scope of the point of his entire post when you say absolutely nothing that even indicates the very narrow scope of his argument you're responding to? That's not a reading comprehension issue. That's a failure to communicate what you're actually talking about issue.

    And to boot, your point about M60's makes your response even more silly because it makes his same argument. You have to pray to get a single item to drop so you can try a build revolving around that item. Nice job making his argument for him I guess?

    Edit: Let me say it this way. His post was lamenting the luck or RNG aspect of loot rewards. You respond by saying you like the speed of acquisition (not something he commented about) and then comment about the M60 which is even more gated behind RNG/luck than what he was talking about and go so far as to say you hope one drops so you can try a build based on it in your next game, which is even more extreme than the point he's making. Think about that for a second. How does your comment do anything except talk about things he wasn't talking about or reinforce his point?
    Last edited by Niil945; 12-07-2019 at 02:21 AM.

  13. #193
    Leader Laz Man's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Niil945 View Post
    You quoted his entire post and then expect someone to infer you're referencing single very specific comment outside the scope of the point of his entire post when you say absolutely nothing that even indicates the very narrow scope of his argument you're responding to? That's not a reading comprehension issue. That's a failure to communicate what you're actually talking about issue.

    And to boot, your point about M60's makes your response even more silly because it makes his same argument. You have to pray to get a single item to drop so you can try a build revolving around that item. Nice job making his argument for him I guess?

    Edit: Let me say it this way. His post was lamenting the luck or RNG aspect of loot rewards. You respond by saying you like the speed of acquisition (not something he commented about) and then comment about the M60 which is even more gated behind RNG/luck than what he was talking about and go so far as to say you hope one drops so you can try a build based on it in your next game, which is even more extreme than the point he's making. Think about that for a second. How does your comment do anything except talk about things he wasn't talking about or reinforce his point?
    Perhaps I could have quoted his specific sentence but decided not to because his entire post was just a few sentences long. I figured most would have understood what I meant but It looks like I was wrong about that.

    You could have also have chosen to ask me to elaborate instead of completely disregarding my response with an insult.

    Edit: Also, why are you responding on his behalf? For all you know, he understood where I was coming from and had a response for me?

    Edit2: I apologize for the reading comprehension comment. Had a ♥♥♥♥ty day at work and your turtle comment irked me...
    Last edited by Laz Man; 12-07-2019 at 02:41 AM.

  14. #194
    Super Moderator Roland's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Niil945 View Post
    You quoted his entire post and then expect someone to infer you're referencing single very specific comment outside the scope of the point of his entire post when you say absolutely nothing that even indicates the very narrow scope of his argument you're responding to? That's not a reading comprehension issue. That's a failure to communicate what you're actually talking about issue.

    And to boot, your point about M60's makes your response even more silly because it makes his same argument. You have to pray to get a single item to drop so you can try a build revolving around that item. Nice job making his argument for him I guess?

    Edit: Let me say it this way. His post was lamenting the luck or RNG aspect of loot rewards. You respond by saying you like the speed of acquisition (not something he commented about) and then comment about the M60 which is even more gated behind RNG/luck than what he was talking about and go so far as to say you hope one drops so you can try a build based on it in your next game, which is even more extreme than the point he's making. Think about that for a second. How does your comment do anything except talk about things he wasn't talking about or reinforce his point?
    His entire post? It was two short paragraphs. It was pretty clear to me that Laz was taking what Papa was saying and turning it around to a positive way to look at it.

    Papa was lamenting that you cant always find that specific thing you want when you need it. Laz was saying that that quality adds replay value to the game and allows for multiple play throughs to not feel samey

    Id say both perspectives are true at the same time and one doesnt disprove or invalidate the other. It can be frustrating not finding what you want AND it makes the next time you play different if your luck runs differently.

    Im also right AT THE SAME TIME because no matter how you look at it the player can craft up to the highest tier they need in order to be beyond well equipped and that is Tier 5.

  15. #195
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    Quote Originally Posted by Laz Man View Post
    You could have also have chosen to ask me to elaborate instead of completely disregarding my response with an insult...think about that for a second.
    It's not an insult to tell you that your response has no bearing on the point he was making. Shifting the goalpost to "I'm talking about one line of his post" doesn't even make sense when that one line is out of context. He was not, even in that line, providing feedback about the speed of acquisition which is the point you made. His point was always about the rng/luck nature of tier 6 loot rewards. And while you tell me that I could ask you to elaborate, that's exactly what I did. Here's exactly what I said:

    I'm confused. What does crafting stuff have anything to do with getting them right away.

    But hey, if you get salty about the most trivial of challenges, by all means, be salty. I'm not even knocking your opinion about how you like how random loot rewards dictate your builds. If that's what you find fun, cool, more power to you man.

    To the topic at large, I'm relatively new around here so I haven't seen any developers or posts on steam talking about design philosophies regarding loot or the end goal that they're working towards. Do we even know whether this system is final? It sounds like from comments people have made that the system is in transition. I've heard people mention old systems they've transitioned away from (repairing upgrading quality and using parts from one item to improve other items) and legendary items that the current tier 6 are placeholders for. I know doing a clear or fetch/clear tier 5 mission rewards a guaranteed tier 6 item which makes them far more prevalent than the half a dozen in a 100 day playthrough mentioned above by Roland. I can farm a tier 6 item once a game day right now. Then there's the plethora of parts that can't be smelted in the forge and having to acquire 4-5 items of the type one wants to craft before we can craft something which seems kinda silly.

    In the end, some people are going to prefer deterministic systems with minimal luck/rng. Some people are going to believe crafting should be the only method to acquire the best gear. Some people are going to be okay with crafting or questing rewarding comparable. And yet others are going to be okay with rng/luck based loot rewards. It's all a matter of opinion and different people find different things fun. None of those are wrong.

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