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Thread: Developer Discussions: Alpha 17

  1. #14866
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Gronk View Post
    As far as I know the AI system has been completely ripped out and replaced with something better, removing the dependence on the underlying grid system to do pathfinding. I'm quite confident that it'll cure most of the zombie AI problems and quirks... probably replacing them with brand new problems and quirks in the process :-)
    The path generation is a completely new two stage system and works very differently, but the old system is still in there too. We can switch between them for now. Path following and AI are not new, but have been greatly overhauled. I'm sure there will be new issues to deal with.

  2. #14867
    Colon Pounder The Gronk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by faatal View Post
    The path generation is a completely new two stage system and works very differently, but the old system is still in there too. We can switch between them for now. Path following and AI are not new, but have been greatly overhauled. I'm sure there will be new issues to deal with.
    That really does surprise me. Without meaning to be offensive, even in a voxel game the idea of a pure A* variation in a three dimensional game is a bit... archaic... these days.

    Are there any plans to switch to a navmesh? Perhaps when Unity adds navmesh support to the C# job system?
    Last edited by The Gronk; 04-12-2018 at 11:28 PM.

  3. #14868
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    Quote Originally Posted by Guppycur View Post
    Do people line the floor of their horde bases with these healing blocks?
    That's what I do in Starvation to avoid the stupid sanity mechanic.

  4. #14869
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    Quote Originally Posted by CplCritter View Post
    I could see a sleep system working IF implemented right (see project zomboid). I don't personally think this game needs it though. Yes it would add to "oh crap" moments of you start fatigue too far away from your base, but who would want to be forced to miss the blood moon because its nappy time and your toon is tired? Maybe adds a time management element? Still not 100% for it.
    Thats whats when a cup of coffee would come in handy.

    I'm looking forward to u17, really sick of current bug bugs, exploits etc.. But I'd rather wait for a worthwhile update soon.
    Last edited by juk3b0x; 04-13-2018 at 01:52 AM.

  5. #14870
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    Quote Originally Posted by faatal View Post
    The path generation is a completely new two stage system and works very differently, but the old system is still in there too. We can switch between them for now. Path following and AI are not new, but have been greatly overhauled. I'm sure there will be new issues to deal with.
    What do you mean about a two stage system?

  6. #14871
    Leader Aldranon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sillls View Post
    What do you mean about a two stage system?
    As it includes the old AI and a new AI, I'm guessing it will run on one of them until some event happens, or a timer ticks off then switch to the other until another event or timer occurs.

  7. #14872
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aldranon View Post
    As it includes the old AI and a new AI, I'm guessing it will run on one of them until some event happens, or a timer ticks off then switch to the other until another event or timer occurs.
    No. That's not it. The two stage system is completely new. Check out the post below.

    Quote Originally Posted by faatal View Post
    The path generation is a completely new two stage system and works very differently, but the old system is still in there too. We can switch between them for now. Path following and AI are not new, but have been greatly overhauled. I'm sure there will be new issues to deal with.

  8. #14873
    Leader Aldranon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sillls View Post
    No. That's not it. The two stage system is completely new. Check out the post below.
    I see. There is the two stage and THEN there is also the old system! Thanks for the clarification and sorry I couldnt help you.

  9. #14874
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aldranon View Post
    "but the old system is still in there too."
    I guess what Faatal means that they didn't delete old system until new system is fully ready. They are testing/compare between two system and when new one is mature enough they will let go the old one. But for time being during development both system are part. There is no sense keeping both in public release. It is just development process.

  10. #14875
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aldranon View Post
    I see. There is the two stage and THEN there is also the old system! Thanks for the clarification and sorry I couldnt help you.
    No worry's.

  11. #14876
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    Quote Originally Posted by dhlmaster View Post
    Yeah, it works as a minimum effort tactic. Stores made of concrete will usually survive a horde night just fine too if you can find one, and many of them have an easy way to access the roof. I went through a phase where I did that when I would play nomad style. Wasn't worth setting up a base if I was only going to be in a town for a day or two.
    All true... Though take this scenario:
    1. Your playing dead is dead.
    2. You log into a server where there is a few hours until hoardnight.
    3. Your level 1.

    In this case, I see 3 possible ways to survive:
    1. Log out and wait for morning. (Like a little bitch).
    2. Dig a hole and cover the opening with a block. (Very boring, but you do get lots of XP from digging all night).
    3. Take over a POI for the night. (Easy, fun and you get lots of XP from killing zombies if you can hit them).

    That's all I mean really... Obviously it is way more fun to build your own base... But if your not able, then: See above

  12. #14877
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    Quote Originally Posted by sillls View Post
    Yeah but what is the new two stage system? I'm Hoping Faatal will give us a heads up.
    If I have to guess, it is two stage as first is Path Finding, and second is detecting Player. These are two different part of AI they need in Zombie, Path finding can be just roaming around, and trying to reach a point in map. It should cover jumping, circling, stair climbing, finding nearest door, etc.

    To define the point/place in map is where "Sense " came in, i.e. a visibility, smell, sound, heat etc ..

    - - - Updated - - -

    There is third part of AI.. attacking, when to swing arm so it hit the target and how to swing, if target is above head level or below.

  13. #14878
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    Quote Originally Posted by sillls View Post
    What do you mean about a two stage system?
    My guess is that the first stage decides about a general path between zombie position and target location using a few straight lines. It makes sure that the zombie uses doors or other openings if available instead of going straight to the target.

    The second stage looks for the immediate direction the zombie takes, for example to go around small obstacles like a cactus or a fellow zombie or even introduce evasive movement so the player has a harder time shooting
    Last edited by meganoth; 04-13-2018 at 02:01 PM.

  14. #14879
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    Quote Originally Posted by juk3b0x View Post
    Thats whats when a cup of coffee would come in handy.
    Very good point. Could add an extra function to coffee. I wouldn't be mad if a good sleep system was implemented in SP, but I'm not knocking down TFP's door to try to make it happen.

  15. #14880
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Gronk View Post
    That really does surprise me. Without meaning to be offensive, even in a voxel game the idea of a pure A* variation in a three dimensional game is a bit... archaic... these days.

    Are there any plans to switch to a navmesh? Perhaps when Unity adds navmesh support to the C# job system?
    Navmesh was tried last year and found to be too slow. (that was not even taking into account the issues I said below)

    The path system in 7dtd has to handle the fact that anything can be a path, since it can be broken and the world dynamically changes all the time as blocks are added/removed, which gives a lot of standard path systems big problems.

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