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Thread: Developer Diary: Alpha 17

  1. #15931
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    Quote Originally Posted by -Holo- View Post
    This is not specifically A17 question, but seeing that you are a system-mastermind of many things™ perhaps the best person to ask about Unity's odd performance issues?

    It's something I have noticed in every single Unity game that offers "unlimited" building, 7 Days, Kerbal Space Program, Empyrion, Planet Explorers and more that I can't recall the names of just now, (Yes, I'm a sucker for survival/crafting games ) but as soon as a certain point of complexity is reached, the engine chokes and framerate drops.

    I always keep track on how much resources are used from the computer (hurray for MSI afterburner and logitech g19), and it's not limited to the computers power, plenty of ram free, no cpu cores are even close to being maxed, generally over half the vram is free and the graphicscard is not being utilized nearly fully.

    (in 7days one example would be the skyscrapers where the framerate is cut in half but no strain is put on the hardware)

    Is this something that's on the radar, and more important, is it something that can be fixed/lessened?

    /Holo
    Something is bottlenecking the game. I don't know what it is but you may need to talk to a computer guy. Could try Best Buy, The Geek squad, at the store.

    I've also found this link that may help: https://www.bestbuy.com/site/electro...at138100050018
    I have never used this link though and recommend that you call the store and ask for The Geek squad.

  2. #15932
    Reconstructionist Menace312's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by -Holo- View Post
    This is not specifically A17 question, but seeing that you are a system-mastermind of many things™ perhaps the best person to ask about Unity's odd performance issues?

    It's something I have noticed in every single Unity game that offers "unlimited" building, 7 Days, Kerbal Space Program, Empyrion, Planet Explorers and more that I can't recall the names of just now, (Yes, I'm a sucker for survival/crafting games ) but as soon as a certain point of complexity is reached, the engine chokes and framerate drops.

    I always keep track on how much resources are used from the computer (hurray for MSI afterburner and logitech g19), and it's not limited to the computers power, plenty of ram free, no cpu cores are even close to being maxed, generally over half the vram is free and the graphicscard is not being utilized nearly fully.

    (in 7days one example would be the skyscrapers where the framerate is cut in half but no strain is put on the hardware)

    Is this something that's on the radar, and more important, is it something that can be fixed/lessened?

    /Holo
    Its hard to pin down, right?
    I've noticed it too...

    It doesn't seem to matter much what you do in the graphical options. It seems you just get to a point, where there are too much going on, calculation wise, and you get the microstutter.

    As you point out, I think its a limitation in the Unity engine.
    Now... Im in no way a game programmer, but the voxelbased Unity engine is complex, and a new idea, and they are actively updating it... So it may get better eventually.

    But! All that said... I haven't really been able to find any info on this online?
    So maybe Unity themselfs are scratching their heads over this?
    Or maybe the survival games using the engine are all badly optimised at this point (unlikely this).

    Anyone in the know?

  3. #15933
    Beloved Curmudgeon DaVegaNL's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kinyajuu View Post
    What a lot of the impatient complainers here seem to not know or forget is that I personally handle a LARGE portion of the systems in this game, how they are designed and how they work together. If I were to explain it all most of your eyes would simply glaze over, trust me. I now (as of A17) handle Animation Code support, Buffs, avatar controllers, entity stats systems, and UFPS on top of already owning RWG, UMA, items, progression, crafting, xui.

    So yes, we added more people. That's not going to speed things up, it's simply going to make it better quality. Having 20 heart surgeons in an OR doesn't speed up the operation now does it? It does however ensure a better quality result as more people are looking at things.

    People can complain about timelines all they want. We finally figured out what all systems there would be, sat down with our new Game Designer and balanced things out and discussed how they talk to each other, I wrote the new min effect system to encompass all desired functionality so that we can easily expand with little or no code support in the future. Providing not only backward compatibility, but more things modders will be able to edit from xml, making a better experience for A17 and beyond.

    So sure, it's going slow, but that's because we redistributed the systems and I took over more for this alpha to get a solid framework in.

    Sorry had to pull out my +1 club of common sense there. Back to the staff of kindness. lol

    Note: Money helps me live but it has never been and will never be my goal personally. I've reached my goal. Make games for a living. Everything else is icing on the cake for me.
    Thanks for the update! Since RWG is on your plate as well, can I ask if you did something noteworthy on it over the past few months? Just curious!

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Prisma501 View Post
    Hey man. I took Gazz's advise on adding users to ignore list and i must say that is making forum life a LOT less toxic for me.

    Its userprofile -> add to ignore list. Easy peasy. No more crap visible from the mikee's and davega's and all those < 15 posts badly raised kids. They go on there on first read too. Loving it from the minute i started using that handy feature.

    Cheers
    I'm getting flashbacks from my teenage years, when blocking people on MSN Messenger was all the rage. Then unblocking them. Then blocking them. Such maturity.

  4. #15934
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    Quote Originally Posted by Menace312 View Post
    Its hard to pin down, right?
    I've noticed it too...

    It doesn't seem to matter much what you do in the graphical options. It seems you just get to a point, where there are too much going on, calculation wise, and you get the microstutter.

    As you point out, I think its a limitation in the Unity engine.
    Now... Im in no way a game programmer, but the voxelbased Unity engine is complex, and a new idea, and they are actively updating it... So it may get better eventually.

    But! All that said... I haven't really been able to find any info on this online?
    So maybe Unity themselfs are scratching their heads over this?
    Or maybe the survival games using the engine are all badly optimised at this point (unlikely this).

    Anyone in the know?
    There is a piece of info on improving performance in there. Its still evolving though, but i think the underlying unity engine will give us the boost to overcome those performance hurdles eventually.

    https://blogs.unity3d.com/2017/07/11...ng-unity-2017/

    Cheers

  5. #15935
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    So you want 7DTD to perform better, build a faster computer core.

    When it comes to CPU's there are two metrics that really matter, how many parallel calculations can be done and the speed at which they can be completed.
    Specifically since many calculations are required simultaneously the speed at which they can be completed is the metric in which we define performance of the game.
    The short explanation is your CPU matters, lets use the Intel Core i7-7820X Skylake-X 8-Core 3.6 GHz LGA 2066 for this example, while it is not Intel's flagship it is the most robust most capable i7 ever made.
    Without getting into a bunch of mind numbing numbers and statistics suffice it to say that this CPU is a beast capable of destroying the most demanding games.
    There are two sides of the coin and the graphics card isn't the end all and be all of frames per second, if you want to go fast build a faster computer core and then add a state of the art graphics card.
    Last edited by Xeen; 4 Weeks Ago at 08:08 AM.

  6. #15936
    Reconstructionist Menace312's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Prisma501 View Post
    There is a piece of info on improving performance in there. Its still evolving though, but i think the underlying unity engine will give us the boost to overcome those performance hurdles eventually.

    https://blogs.unity3d.com/2017/07/11...ng-unity-2017/

    Cheers
    Thx prisma, I have been stalking that blog a bit too . Nothing concrete though...

    It seems to be a work in progress.
    But that's hardly surprising with the Unity guys...
    They seem to have a lot of loose ends, or possible features...
    Depends on your preferred way of looking at it

  7. #15937
    Reconstructionist Menace312's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xeen View Post
    So you want 7DTD to perform better, build a faster computer core.

    -snip-
    If this was directed towards me, I will point you to the original OP's post. That was Halo.

    If you read that, you'd know that the PC is not the factor here...

    I know PC hardware young Padawan...

  8. #15938
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kinyajuu View Post
    If I were to explain it all most of your eyes would simply glaze over, trust me.
    I can vouch for that, I often have no idea what you are saying and I'm not a novice at coding

  9. #15939
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    Quote Originally Posted by Menace312 View Post
    If this was directed towards me, I will point you to the original OP's post. That was Halo.

    If you read that, you'd know that the PC is not the factor here...

    I know PC hardware young Padawan...
    It wasn't directed at anyone in particular, just at anyone wondering why their game doesn't run very well.

    I have a gaming rig with said CPU and it runs 7DTD flawlessly at max settings, even with the advanced visual processing toys turned on.

    As far as the young Padawan comment goes, lol I've been building computers since 1995, most of the kids that post here weren't even born yet.
    Last edited by Xeen; 4 Weeks Ago at 10:08 AM.

  10. #15940
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    Please stop the bull♥♥♥♥ comments on this section no one cares about how the game is running on your computer. I get constant 80-90 FPS on a 2560x1080 wide monitor with GTX 1060 3 gb and i5 . I just turn off the shadows and everything works perfect.Just go work and if you love so much 7 DTD buy a new rig ♥♥♥♥♥♥. You all are just cry baby. I like this game so much im happy with Alpha 16.4 too. If you criticise and wants Alpha 17 faster then go and donate 10$ million and they will relase it the next day you idiots. I come on Alpha 17 developer diary to read news i dont wanna see your bull♥♥♥♥ here about how the game is running on your ♥♥♥♥ti computer

  11. #15941
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    Quote Originally Posted by iLikeIT View Post
    Please stop the bull♥♥♥♥ comments on this section no one cares about how the game is running on your computer. I get constant 80-90 FPS on a 2560x1080 wide monitor with GTX 1060 3 gb and i5 . I just turn off the shadows and everything works perfect.Just go work and if you love so much 7 DTD buy a new rig ♥♥♥♥♥♥. You all are just cry baby. I like this game so much im happy with Alpha 16.4 too. If you criticise and wants Alpha 17 faster then go and donate 10$ million and they will relase it the next day you idiots. I come on Alpha 17 developer diary to read news i dont wanna see your bull♥♥♥♥ here about how the game is running on your ♥♥♥♥ti computer
    That's harsh dude, did you forget to take your meds again?

  12. #15942
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    Quote Originally Posted by -Holo- View Post
    I always keep track on how much resources are used from the computer (hurray for MSI afterburner and logitech g19), and it's not limited to the computers power, plenty of ram free, no cpu cores are even close to being maxed, generally over half the vram is free and the graphicscard is not being utilized nearly fully.

    /Holo
    You also need to take into account HD speed, all the ground chunks are saved to individual files, when you come into range of a skyscraper the file it needs to load is larger than normal and so takes time to load, before it can begin to process using your CPU and GPU. HD RPM speed and HD cache both help with loading and saving chunks.

    I used to use a slow HD and found my FPS rate reduce significantly when riding the mini bike at full speed near a town or city, loading new chunks, saving old ones. Changing the drive the game was installed on sped things up for me after a CPU and GPU upgrade had reached its FPS limit. A SSD would have worked even better and that is next on my upgrade list I think.

  13. #15943
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gepps View Post
    You also need to take into account HD speed, all the ground chunks are saved to individual files, when you come into range of a skyscraper the file it needs to load is larger than normal and so takes time to load, before it can begin to process using your CPU and GPU. HD RPM speed and HD cache both help with loading and saving chunks.

    I used to use a slow HD and found my FPS rate reduce significantly when riding the mini bike at full speed near a town or city, loading new chunks, saving old ones. Changing the drive the game was installed on sped things up for me after a CPU and GPU upgrade had reached its FPS limit. A SSD would have worked even better and that is next on my upgrade list I think.
    Absolutely if your Motherboard supports it buy a Samsung 960 EVO M.2 NVMe you will be glad you did.
    Last edited by Xeen; 4 Weeks Ago at 10:21 AM.

  14. #15944
    Colony Founder Aldranon's Avatar
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    Sometimes I drink too much coffee as well.

    Knowing when to post while high on caffeine is still something I'm working on.

  15. #15945
    Beloved Curmudgeon DaVegaNL's Avatar
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    So does anyone know what will happen to your character upon death? Since the wellness system is being readjusted/replaced. Will your max health/stamina get reduced as it is in A16?

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by iLikeIT View Post
    Please stop the bull♥♥♥♥ comments on this section no one cares about how the game is running on your computer. I get constant 80-90 FPS on a 2560x1080 wide monitor with GTX 1060 3 gb and i5 . I just turn off the shadows and everything works perfect.Just go work and if you love so much 7 DTD buy a new rig ♥♥♥♥♥♥. You all are just cry baby. I like this game so much im happy with Alpha 16.4 too. If you criticise and wants Alpha 17 faster then go and donate 10$ million and they will relase it the next day you idiots. I come on Alpha 17 developer diary to read news i dont wanna see your bull♥♥♥♥ here about how the game is running on your ♥♥♥♥ti computer
    Take a chill-pill mate.

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