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Thread: Underground safety

  1. #1
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    Underground safety

    Seems the pimps are against digging zombies for many reasons. Also seems this will not be addressed until beta-ish.

    So outside of digging and exploding zombies, here are some underground ideas:


    1. High heat
    2. Cave in's (lets get some recently occurring earthquakes in the game! Maybe could play into the reason why the zombies are here)
    3. Lack of oxygen
    4. Gas
    5. Fire
    7. Termites/worms/rodents that eat player built structures over time. Sure you can be underground, but let discourage setting up shop underground!
    8. Flooding

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    As long as they never do any of this, and completely leave tunnels alone, the game will continue to be playable.

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    Quote Originally Posted by fragtzack View Post
    Seems the pimps are against digging zombies for many reasons. Also seems this will not be addressed until beta-ish.

    So outside of digging and exploding zombies, here are some underground ideas:


    1. High heat
    2. Cave in's (lets get some recently occurring earthquakes in the game! Maybe could play into the reason why the zombies are here)
    3. Lack of oxygen
    4. Gas
    5. Fire
    7. Termites/worms/rodents that eat player built structures over time. Sure you can be underground, but let discourage setting up shop underground!
    8. Flooding
    Obviously you don't approve of underground bases, but item 7 puts you in the "lets make people to play the game a certain way, or make it miserable if they dont". One of the best things about this game is the options and ways to play it. The underground debate has been ongoing for years here. I certainly hope TFP don't relent and cave on this issue. I build mostly above ground, but like to keep options open.

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    Community Moderator SylenThunder's Avatar
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    IMHO, there simply needs to be a few more hazards to underground building.

    1. Air quality.
    2. Chance of flooding. (Which was one of the stated reasons for making the vault door in the first place.)
    3. Heat buildup.
    4. Intelligent AI that will find how to get to you when you are underground.

    It IS a survival game after all. If you want to hide underground, it's easier to just turn off the Z's or play Minecraft.

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    Leader Tin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SylenThunder View Post
    IMHO, there simply needs to be a few more hazards to underground building.

    1. Air quality.
    2. Chance of flooding. (Which was one of the stated reasons for making the vault door in the first place.)
    3. Heat buildup.
    4. Intelligent AI that will find how to get to you when you are underground.

    It IS a survival game after all. If you want to hide underground, it's easier to just turn off the Z's or play Minecraft.
    heh even Minecraft has some underground threats if you don't take the needed precautions to prevent them..

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    3 word solution: Solid Steel Walls :P

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    Quote Originally Posted by SylenThunder View Post
    IMHO, there simply needs to be a few more hazards to underground building.

    1. Air quality.
    2. Chance of flooding. (Which was one of the stated reasons for making the vault door in the first place.)
    3. Heat buildup.
    4. Intelligent AI that will find how to get to you when you are underground.

    It IS a survival game after all. If you want to hide underground, it's easier to just turn off the Z's or play Minecraft.
    Funny, one would think that going underground would be considered an option to surviving in a survival game against zombies. Especially considering you still have to deal with zombies once you pop above ground to loot, kill for exp to progress, and gather materials.

    Quote Originally Posted by fragtzack View Post
    Seems the pimps are against digging zombies for many reasons. Also seems this will not be addressed until beta-ish.

    So outside of digging and exploding zombies, here are some underground ideas:


    1. High heat
    2. Cave in's (lets get some recently occurring earthquakes in the game! Maybe could play into the reason why the zombies are here)
    3. Lack of oxygen
    4. Gas
    5. Fire
    7. Termites/worms/rodents that eat player built structures over time. Sure you can be underground, but let discourage setting up shop underground!
    8. Flooding
    I will still fail to understand why people feel the need to have "Living underground" addressed. As though it's a problem, that isn't mostly related to people wanting others to conform to their idea of playing the game.
    Last edited by Bloodyvixen; 01-28-2018 at 10:39 PM.

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    Inventor Menace312's Avatar
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    Just some ramblings...

    All this talk about underground "safety" is really weird to me...
    Who would want to stay there?

    You miss out on all the great loot and xp, which is the only real way to progress, so you can make it in late game.
    Ok, so the zombie spawning is a bit off (especially on hoard nights), but that needs fixing anyway...

    What about the tower safety tactic?
    It's just as easy to do, if not easier in the beginning... Does that not need "fixing" too?

    The underground is just fine the way it is now... It's even immersion correct. It would make sense to be "safe" underground... But boring though.

    I don't mind an intelligently envisioned addition to the underground in terms of gameplay.
    But not a "solution" to a problem that does not exist...
    Last edited by Menace312; 01-28-2018 at 10:41 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Menace312 View Post
    Just some ramblings...

    All this talk about underground "safety" is really weird to me...
    Who would want to stay there?

    You miss out on all the great loot and xp, which is the only real way to progress, so you can make it in late game.
    Ok, so the zombie spawning is a bit off, but that needs fixing anyway...

    What about the tower safety tactic?
    It's just as easy to do, if not easier in the beginning... Does that not need "fixing" too?

    The underground is just fine the way it is now... It's even immersion correct. It would make sense to be "safe" underground... But boring though.

    I don't mind an intelligently envisioned addition to the underground in terms of gameplay.
    But not a "solution" to a problem that does not exist...
    I can't speak for everyone, but when I see people streaming that play underground it's usually just one aspect of their base. I honestly doubt a high number of players spend most of their time underground ignoring the zombies completely. As you stated there are too many drawbacks. and honestly it sounds boring. However, there are likely many players who will have an underground base to compliment above ground builds. There have been entire threads asking people why, and the responses are often reasonable and well thought out.

    Some people for some reason can't stand that other players are choosing to avoid zombies sometimes. It's not enjoying the experience as they choose to enjoy it. There are many people in gaming who can't deal with this. So they demand changes that don't need to be made.

  10. #10
    Inventor Menace312's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bloodyvixen View Post
    I can't speak for everyone, but when I see people streaming that play underground it's usually just one aspect of their base. I honestly doubt a high number of players spend most of their time underground ignoring the zombies completely. As you stated there are too many drawbacks. and honestly it sounds boring. However, there are likely many players who will have an underground base to compliment above ground builds. There have been entire threads asking people why, and the responses are often reasonable and well thought out.

    Some people for some reason can't stand that other players are choosing to avoid zombies sometimes. It's not enjoying the experience as they choose to enjoy it. There are many people in gaming who can't deal with this. So they demand changes that don't need to be made.
    This pretty much sums up how I feel about it...
    I will often augment my builds with underground additions... Sometimes I even start from there...
    It's usually for qol reasons but also design.

    Also, I only create mp games. That way others can join on the fly for various reasons...
    Here underground is handy for a bit of afk, as you cannot pause... Sure you can log out, but qol...

  11. #11
    Inventor Menace312's Avatar
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    Don't get me wrong though...

    I fully understand people seeing vultures in the air, zombies and animals (and soon bandits hopefully) on the ground but nothing at all underground, will notice this.

    My beef is with the way it is presented!
    Do you REALLY want some kind of digging zombie. Or could it be something better?

    As SylenThunder suggests there could be additions like air and heat problems. This would be very cool, but I doubt it will satisfy those liking the diggers.

    I like the idea of encountering some kind of new zombie underground. Like a mole of some kind .
    But it would need to only live in the stone layer or not dig more than a little borrow or.... And then theres how it would work with hoard night... Problems problems problems.
    Last edited by Menace312; 01-28-2018 at 11:14 PM.

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    Super Moderator Roland's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fragtzack View Post
    Sure you can be underground, but let discourage setting up shop underground!
    Oi Vey....

    Talk about shooting yourself in the foot.

    How about having underground threats that encourage people to play in that environment because it is fun and challenging and not a complete and utter snoozefest? I think there are a lot of good ideas that can be done but all of it should be done to increase fun and challenge and not to limit or stop people from going places they want to go.

    Also, what makes you think the devs are against a form of digging zombie or that a zombie that can dig won't be addressed until beta?

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    Super Moderator Roland's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bloodyvixen View Post
    I will still fail to understand why people feel the need to have "Living underground" addressed. As though it's a problem, that isn't mostly related to people wanting others to conform to their idea of playing the game.
    There is a problem with living underground. It isn't interesting enough to encourage me to play there. It needs to be at least as interesting as any of the other biomes. Maybe Frag is concerned about other people playing underground but I'm not. I'm only concerned with me playing underground and right now I don't do it because it is so completely boring and monotonous.

    Quote Originally Posted by Menace312 View Post

    All this talk about underground "safety" is really weird to me...
    Who would want to stay there?
    Exactly. That is why I want it changed so that I will want to stay there and actually have game to play.

  14. #14
    Inventor Menace312's Avatar
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    And there he is! Roland the champion of the "underground must be changed".... Naah I'm kidding .

    It would be nice to get more gameplay out of this vast area... But I still don't like the idea of diggers ruining my world.

    I like my huge builds looking nice dammit! Not a scene filled with holes and SI issues by day 10...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Menace312 View Post
    Don't get me wrong though...

    I fully understand people seeing vultures in the air, zombies and animals (and soon bandits hopefully) on the ground but nothing at all underground, will notice this.

    My beef is with the way it is presented!
    Do you REALLY want some kind of digging zombie. Or could it be something better?

    As SylenThunder suggests there could be additions like air and heat problems. This would be very cool, but I doubt it will satisfy those liking the diggers.

    I like the idea of encountering some kind of new zombie underground. Like a mole of some kind .
    But it would need to only live in the stone layer or not dig more than a little borrow or.... And then theres how it would work with hoard night... Problems problems problems.
    There are a few things that irritate me in the gaming community, and the biggest is people's inability to handle game play that differs from their own. Especially when it is then followed by a self righteous tirade about how that different game-play isn't "how the game is supposed to be played" or even more contrite "Well, you are cheating yourself of enjoying the full experience!".

    Personally I don't like the concept of digging enemies in this game. Well, I don't like the idea of it being able to silently appear during a horde and start digging its way under and in. If they were to add a digging enemy, I still stand by what I proposed in an earlier thread. Make it a special dog that has the ability to summon like a screamer.

    This dog would be later game in higher end stages. If it senses you (and you will hear it when it approaches) it will bay/howl and cause other dogs to appear. Those dogs would potentially follow the special dog if it were to manage to start digging a hole and find its way in. I like this because it's a better presentation. Digging dogs make sense. Imagine the dread in a single player or multi when you hear that animal and you realize you only have but so long before that thing becomes a huge problem (should it sense you).

    Anything that will be a major threat to the integrity of a base needs to give the player a chance to at least recognize it is around. That is why later game the puking cops being radioactive is just wonderful, or even the regular puking cops at least have a specific sound and shape that is recognizable in the distance.

    As for other hazards, as long as it doesn't break the game similar to how sleepers did I'm sure there are all sorts of ways to make the underground more interesting. I'm sure the pimps have to weigh the risks and benefits, and if such additions will be worth it in the long haul.

    Quote Originally Posted by Roland View Post
    There is a problem with living underground. It isn't interesting enough to encourage me to play there. It needs to be at least as interesting as any of the other biomes. Maybe Frag is concerned about other people playing underground but I'm not. I'm only concerned with me playing underground and right now I don't do it because it is so completely boring and monotonous.
    What would make it interesting for you to want to play there?
    Last edited by Bloodyvixen; 01-28-2018 at 11:47 PM.

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