View Poll Results: Which of these two would you consider the more important main feature

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  • A story driven by main and side quests.

    33 22.00%
  • A randomly generated world with smooth terrain.

    117 78.00%
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Thread: Which is the more important main feature of the game?

  1. #91
    Colony Founder Maharin's Avatar
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  2. #92
    Inventor Bimbie's Avatar
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    I like the Mystery.

    Where am I? ....dunno
    How did I get her in the woods? ... dunno
    WHERE ARE MY CLOTHES!!! ... angry & dunno

  3. #93
    Inventor toores's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DeadMole View Post
    I seriously have no idea where this mentality of wanting storylines out of videogames comes from. "Go read a book" and whatnot, what the heck? Even the original Final Fantasy had a storyline going on and that was over 30 years ago. So now we're supposed to get multiplayer games with a lame storyline stuck to it?
    Please do not misrepresent what i'm saying.
    I would love to have a good story line for 7d2d. I' simply saying, in a game like 7d2d, the game mechanics are far more important for it to be a good game.
    Even quest system is more important then a good "main sory" because modders will add so much replay value you simply can't get from a single main quest.
    If it is easy for modders to create fallout 3/NV-like conversations with NPCs and add conditions to it, like skill checks for some answers or item checks, then you will have more quality quest to play trough in the long run.

    There are other, more linear, games where good story is most important but not in the case of 7d2d or minecraft for that matter.
    Last edited by toores; 02-17-2018 at 11:57 AM.

  4. #94
    Tracker DeadMole's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by toores View Post
    Please do not misrepresent what i'm saying.

    There are other, more linear, games where good story is most important but not in the case of 7d2d or minecraft for that matter.
    I was refering to players who said that stories should be taken out of games and that I should read a book instead.

    As I mentioned 7 Days has a strong Fallout feel to it, and it would seem lackluster not to have a decent main quest/storyline for the more linear Navezgane experience.

    I've been addressing this from the viewpoint of average players who are getting into the game, but there's another viewpoint that is quite important: game reviewers. And I'm speaking of professional critics working for reputable publications here. They will naturally play the linear Navezgane "campaign" first, before going any deeper into it. So, will a solid quest system affect the score of the game more than a RGW feature they might not even notice? Also, if the game seems unfinished and is still broken upon final release, it will get trashed just like the console version did. Think of AC Unity. I know for a fact (figure of speech) that none of us would want that eh. Ubisoft is one of my favorite dev, but I don't trust them anymore than I trust TFP.
    Last edited by DeadMole; 02-17-2018 at 05:29 PM.

  5. #95
    Hunter TotallyNotABot's Avatar
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    Story's can come after the world is finished IMO

  6. #96
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    Quote Originally Posted by toores View Post
    Haha... I think we have pretty good game already. No story to it, but great game mechanics. Now strip all that and add a story instead - all you got is telltale game a interactive movie basically
    Hi,

    So yeah, a few people quoted me, and I'm choosing to reply to you

    I recognize that we already have game mechanics which adds fun to the game, so of course, yes the game mechanics and the basic gameplay elements should be in place as they're incredibly important to making a good game, as you say, otherwise we end up with a telltale game.

    Now my reason for voting for the story however, is that I feel that games that provide great tools but no reason to use those tools fall flat compared to games where they give a real reason to actually use the tools given.

    I think we've reached an age, 2018, where we should start thinking about how we add a deeper reason and meaning to the activaties we ask the player to perform. I'm not talking about old style quests where you're told to fetch X amount of something, as they're as flat and pointless as a game with no gameplay.
    I'm talking about a game of consequence and attachment. I want a game which makes me care for other entities, a game that makes me want to protect/hurt these entities and a game that punishes me if I fail to achieve my goals, be they good or evil. A game where if I ignore something it changes my environment or grows larger and more powerful until it attacks and I lose.

    This is why I voted for the storyline, as I truly don't believe that you can call a game a true game in 2018, if it doesn't somehow make you "care".
    Right now the game objective is mainly to survive, or build something grand, but this quickly becomes trivial and once this has been achieved, then what is the point? Time to start over?
    I don't think having a game where you need to start over to give yourself something to do is good game design.
    Last edited by KanedaSyndrome; 02-17-2018 at 09:05 PM.

  7. #97
    Community Moderator Crater Creator's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DeadMole View Post
    Also, if the game seems unfinished and is still broken upon final release, it will get trashed just like the console version did. Think of AC Unity. I know for a fact (figure of speech) that none of us would want that eh.
    What the heck is "I know for a fact" supposed to mean if it's used figuratively instead of literally? If you mean "I think that..." or "I assume that..." then you should just say it that way, for accuracy. I wouldn't be a stickler for this, except asserting the certainty of your assumptions without justification has caused much argument around your posts in recent days.

    I would just stick to your strongest argument, which to me is: 7DtD legitimately qualifies as a role playing game at this point, and a story/main quest line/however you want to phrase it is an important, obligatory component for that genre.

  8. #98
    Inventor Siveria's Avatar
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    Why can't we have both? Could make special POI's that are directly story related that only spawn once per world, and each part of the quest will lead you towards the next special story poi. Make each a well made unique poi, and make sure to set ti so they can always spawn in randon gen but will only spawn once.

  9. #99
    Tracker DeadMole's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KanedaSyndrome View Post
    Now my reason for voting for the story however, is that I feel that games that provide great tools but no reason to use those tools fall flat compared to games where they give a real reason to actually use the tools given.
    That's an interesting point. Having to deal with the action RPG elements and the crafting part throughout a strong main quest would seem like the best way to at least begin using those tools. Especially since 7 Days is such a complex blend with much to offer, might as well have a story where you need to use those tools.

    Quote Originally Posted by Crater Creator View Post
    What the heck is "I know for a fact" supposed to mean if it's used figuratively instead of literally? If you mean "I think that..." or "I assume that..." then you should just say it that way, for accuracy. I wouldn't be a stickler for this, except asserting the certainty of your assumptions without justification has caused much argument around your posts in recent days.

    I would just stick to your strongest argument, which to me is: 7DtD legitimately qualifies as a role playing game at this point, and a story/main quest line/however you want to phrase it is an important, obligatory component for that genre.
    Ah, got to love aruguing semantics. Who really does care how I phrase my posts? I think members has been nitpicky just to get into an argument for the sake of it.

    So I'm not allowed to post other arguments than those you judge important?

  10. #100
    Community Moderator OzHawkeye's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DeadMole View Post
    So I'm not allowed to post other arguments than those you judge important?
    I don't think Crater is saying that at all - and certainly I've never seen during my time as a Community Moderator anything moderated merely because it was critical. So, to be clear, please be critical of the lack of a story in the game, if a story in the game is important to you, or you feel it's important to the games success.

    I think the point Crater was picking up on as that you used a phrase normally used literally, but employed it figuratively - indeed, you then had to qualify your remarks to point out you were using it figuratively and not literally, somewhat negating the point of using it at all.

    Where some viewpoints can get let down to a degree, is when the person advocating for them, does it so stridently that they're claiming the sky is falling if x, y or z is/is not implemented.

    Personally, I have no interest in a story line for 7dtd, but I can see how it would help the game, both for players who enjoy that sort of thing, and for potential reviewers, so I've also got no objection to the Pimps spending time on it, so long as it doesn't overly detract from time spent on actual game play mechanics and remains something voluntary, rather than necessary, to play.

  11. #101
    Tracker DeadMole's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OzHawkeye View Post
    I don't think Crater is saying that at all - and certainly I've never seen during my time as a Community Moderator anything moderated merely because it was critical. So, to be clear, please be critical of the lack of a story in the game, if a story in the game is important to you, or you feel it's important to the games success.

    I think the point Crater was picking up on as that you used a phrase normally used literally, but employed it figuratively - indeed, you then had to qualify your remarks to point out you were using it figuratively and not literally, somewhat negating the point of using it at all.
    That's what I've been doing all along, but of course when you post a wall of text people are going to find sentences in it they can argue about. That's just how it goes. I like doing that with Rolland, but I can feel your pain moderating that though. I'm aware that if I were more concise it would avoid getting into endless arguments.

    I got that, but the thing is I don't think it's so important. As I said, who really cares how I phrase my posts. When I do post, I'm not so worried about using the exact word for accuracy sake. Perhaps I should be, because I wouldn't have to clarify everything I'm saying afterwards haha.

  12. #102
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    Quote Originally Posted by Siveria View Post
    Why can't we have both? Could make special POI's that are directly story related that only spawn once per world, and each part of the quest will lead you towards the next special story poi. Make each a well made unique poi, and make sure to set ti so they can always spawn in randon gen but will only spawn once.
    A good starting point I'd say. But how would this be shaped so it isn't just a disguised "Go to X, get Y, do Z and deliver to O"?

  13. #103
    Community Moderator OzHawkeye's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DeadMole View Post
    Perhaps I should be, because I wouldn't have to clarify everything I'm saying afterwards haha.
    We all have our failings. While you may struggle for clarity, I have always battled for brevity.

  14. #104
    Tracker Shivan78's Avatar
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    "A story driven by main and side quests."

    To me this is already there. The story is that the world as we knew it is gone and now taken over by zombies and other abominations. The main quest is to survive in the middle of hell. Side quests are doing things that help, like establishing contact with traders, building bridges to cross rivers easily, exploring towns and cities for extra things that aren't crucial to helping you survive, but making it easier or bolstering your base.

    I'm a long time gamer of survival horror and crafting games. And when diving into another, these things are just done with no thought. But after a while, it became just another game. A friend of mine who is huge on role playing showed me how to do what comes as second nature or as parts of playing the game as ways to set goals or make quests out of them. Give yourself quests.

    Quest 1.) Gather 1,000 lumber/iron.
    Quest 2.) Craft X amount of Y.
    Quest 3.) Find other life. (Traders.)

    Try not to burn through content and pace yourself as if it were actually you in the game and go from there. It also helps if you can make friends who are willing to add role play elements to the game as well. Make up tasks, such as use the gyrocopter (when it's out) to do some air recon and look for a good place to start another base. Get in there and use your imagination to the fullest. Get crazy, silly, serious. The only limit to the game is yourself.

  15. #105
    Tracker DeadMole's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OzHawkeye View Post
    We all have our failings. While you may struggle for clarity, I have always battled for brevity.
    Nobody's perfect eh, that's for sure. I should be battling for brevity as well, I think most members would agree haha.

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